Challenger chef, judge and the owner of Mŏkbar, Esther Choi shares her introduction to the culinary world and mission to celebrate Korean culture through her craft.
Challenger chef, judge and the owner of Mŏkbar, Esther Choi shares her introduction to the culinary world and mission to celebrate Korean culture through her craft. She reflects on her initial introduction to Food Network and treasured memories made while cooking with her grandmother. Chef Esther emphasizes the value of cooking with fresh, homegrown ingredients, making each element by hand and other lessons her grandmother taught her. Reminiscing about elementary school days in Korea, she offers her perspective on their culture and cuisine. Esther dishes on the New York restaurant scene, praising its diverse representation of the Korean flavor spectrum. She shares her strategy for introducing Americans in small towns and big cities to her roots and encouraging them to cook with Korean elements. The restaurateur reveals challenges and considerations she had to make when scaling her concept into three restaurants and planning menus for each. Esther explains the cultural significance of shareable food and her people-first approach to curating menus. Finally, the Beat Bobby Flay winner opens up about judging and competing on television, spilling her rigorous training techniques.
Find episode transcripts here: https://food-network-obsessed.simplecast.com/episodes/esther-choi-champions-the-global-sport-of-korean-food
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Learn More About Beat Bobby Flay: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/beat-bobby-flay
Learn More About Battle of the Brothers: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/battle-of-the-brothers
Learn More About Money Hungry: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/money-hungry
Learn More About Supermarket Stakeout: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/supermarket-stakeout
Learn More About Family Meal: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/family-meal
Learn More About Chopped: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/chopped
Learn More About Throwdown with Michael Symon: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/throwdown-with-michael-symon
Learn More About Iron Chef: https://www.foodnetwork.com/shows/iron-chef
Jaymee Sire:
Hello, hello and welcome to Food Network Obsessed. This is the podcast where we dish on all things food with your favorite chefs, food influencers, and Food Network stars. I'm your host Jaymee Sere, and today we have a Korean chef on the podcast to talk about how the pillars of Korean culture shape her appreciation for every dish she cooks. She is a chef, restaurateur and owner of Mokbar in New York City. It's Esther Choi. Esther, welcome to the podcast and congratulations on becoming a Food Network Hot Lister. I know you worked at Food Network a few years ago, so how do you describe this full circle moment for you?
Esther Choi:
Well, thank you for having me, Jaymee. I'm super excited to be here and very excited obviously to be on the hot list this year. I guess it's weird because, you know, 15 years ago or so, I was working at the Food Network kitchens, and I guess I almost manifested this moment
Jaymee Sire:
I mean, back then, what were your aspirations like when you started working at the Food Network kitchens?
Esther Choi:
I think that growing up watching Food Network really inspired me to want to kind of go into the whole industry of, I guess just like production. And I was just always very, very curious. And that's kind of like how, why I started, I started as an intern and then moved on and worked there full-time. Mm-hmm. and watching all the chefs, and I think working closely with chefs really inspired me to do and want to do my own thing. So I, I think that meeting like such talented people and being around that really kind of aspire, like it gave me that aspiration and wanting to do that myself as well.
Jaymee Sire:
As a chef, you are especially passionate about food obviously, but as an expression of culture, how did growing up close to your grandmother who is a Korean native influence your perspective on food and cooking?
Esther Choi:
Well, I think it, it, it's just only natural, right? Growing up with a grandmother that literally cooked every single moment in her life, like that's all she wanted to do all the time. Like morning to night, she was always in the kitchen, in the garden, cooking something for our family or for the church or, and it's, it's just being around that all the time made me want to do that as well. I mean, I, I think that I was definitely a unique kid who loved just like being in the kitchen with grandma. Like none of my other siblings are like that
Jaymee Sire:
What was the first thing that you remember like learning to make with her?
Esther Choi:
Oh, God, that's like kind of a crazy question
Jaymee Sire:
What did, what did she think about your, you know, your interest in being in the kitchen with her at all times versus like you said, your siblings who had no interest at all?
Esther Choi:
Jaymee Sire:
Mm-hmm, did she have like any kitchen rules that you had to abide by that you maybe still follow today?
Esther Choi:
The biggest thing that I always take away from my grandmother is, you know, the way that she thought about food. It, it's her thoughtfulness of every single ingredient and to really like, care for it. Like, it, it's not just a dish, it's like a dish filled with love, the effort that you put in, even, you know, things like growing. She grew all of her own like vegetables mm-hmm. And always like did a big harvest and every little thing that she did would take like so much time mm-hmm. , but that, that's like the whole process, you know, you have to trust the process and really kind of give it all your love, you know?
Jaymee Sire:
Mm-hmm, and, and I know, you know, it was important for your family, for you to appreciate your Korean culture, and I know you guys all moved there for several years. What was that period of immersion like for you in your life?
Esther Choi:
Oh, you did your research, huh?
Jaymee Sire:
Mm-hmm, what, what are your favorite elements of Korean culture? Whether it's food or, you know, otherwise.
Esther Choi:
I mean, food definitely
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
Well, I think the biggest thing is cooking seasonally is very important because, you know, you want to eat things at its best form and you know, if you harvest it yourself, I mean, my dream would be to like have my own garden
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. Good things take time, right?
Esther Choi:
Yeah.. Exactly, exactly.
Jaymee Sire:
How do you think that Korean cuisine is perceived and represented in kind of this global culinary scene?
Esther Choi:
I mean, it's kind of crazy how much it blew up, right? And I, if you see a lot of restaurants now, especially in New York, you see Korean food in all of its form, all of the different forms. And obviously if you go to Korea, there's so many like regional cuisine and it's not just like Korean barbecue, obviously. There's so many layers to Korean food and I think that New York is kind of like this really great global representation of Korean food because you have like the super high end Korean food that lots of chefs are doing, but then you see, you know, like the street food or more like rustic style of Korean food and then you, you know, you go to like the other boroughs like Flushing or even New Jersey and then you get like very specialized Korean food. So I think it's amazing that, you know, we've come this far and I think there's main reason why it did. It's just cuz it's so freaking delicious. You know, why else?
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
Yeah, I mean, I think that it is very important for me and it just became sort of this mission statement of my restaurants to kind of represent Korean food in that way. Because yes, if you're in New York City and you're lucky to live here, to get to try all the different types of Korean food and different types of cuisines, but like if you are in the middle of America or somewhere where there's not very readily available like Korean food, then how do you learn about it? Right? So for me, the approach has always been to share those flavors somehow, whether it be online or through a show, or even competition shows or things like that. Even selling things online through either GoldBelly or, you know, these platforms. It's been sort of this like mission statement for our restaurant to kind of represent Korean food in the best possible way. So it's kind of like a big responsibility
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. You mentioned your restaurant Mockbar has three locations across New York. You also have a Korean cocktail bar. Miss U. Can you kind of take us through what are those menus? What do those experiences look like for somebody, you know, dining at one of your restaurants?
Esther Choi:
So we definitely evolved our concept over time. When we, when I first opened, it was kind of this more specialized noodle shop. We specialized in ramen because the time there was a big kind of ramen boom, people like really were getting into like the whole concept of ramen and it was just a very, very popular item. So I used that kind of as a vehicle to introduce Korean flavors. And this was kind of at the time where Korean food was still very like new to a lot of people, new flavor profile. There's lots of people that never tried Korean food before. And this was kind of my way of introducing Korean flavors, kind of disguising it in a form of a bowl of ramen. And then over time we evolved into more of a quick service type of restaurant, especially managing all the different locations and the volume that we were doing.
We kind of condensed the menu into a more simple form so that, you know, people could have it, you know, every other day. You know, like, I want Korean food to kind of be in this rotation of like, whether you're getting Thai food or Chinese food, or even Italian, like, put Korean into that mix. So we, I kind of wanted to have like a very simple menu, so we kind of evolved into a quick service and now we serve noodle bowls and also rice bowls and Korean snacks, and I hope to kind of add a lot more locations, which is what I'm currently working on. Okay. So yeah, kind of now going beyond New York City and hopefully popping up in new cities.
Jaymee Sire:
I mean, I guess on that note, like what's, what's your vision for, for the restaurant as, as you start expanding and, and bringing these flavors that you talk about to other places other than New York?
Esther Choi:
Well, I feel like there's definitely an opportunity to globalize Korean food even further as like quick service, kind of like fast food, but not fast food because it's healthy and nutritious and uh, really good for you. And, you know, one of the big things is to be able to scale. And that's definitely something that I'm looking, looking forward to do.
Jaymee Sire:
What kind of advice would you give to other chefs maybe considering opening a place of their own? Because you know, obviously it's restaurant business is not for the faint of heart, but I think, you know, most of the chefs we talk to on here like love it, but they also, you know, it also
Esther Choi:
Oh my God, Jaymee, it's so stressful.
Jaymee Sire:
I guess what's your process when you are kind of like formulating a menu or thinking about maybe a new dish that you want to introduce to the, to the menu? Like, what is your process like in, in starting that from like, just like an idea to actually, you know, a menu item?
Esther Choi:
Well, I think the first thing that I think about is what makes a dish special. And thinking about, like, for me, it's always about the person that I'm serving. So I do a lot of special events, kind of like all over the country and even overseas. And I'm always thinking about like the guest experience. And for me, when I'm creating a menu item, that's what I first think about, well, it's like, what's local and seasonal, and then who am I serving? And, you know, pleasing the guests is probably the most important thing because, and that's what my grandmother taught me as well, it's not about you and what you wanna cook mm-hmm. , it's about what you're, who you're cooking for, right? Because in the end, you know, why are we chefs? We l love feeding people and we like to see that satisfaction on their face. So I think that's probably, for me, the one of the most important things that I think about before I formulate a menu. And then thinking about like, the regional and seasonality of the menu or where I'm cooking. So that kind of thing is like the first thoughts. And then of course, you know, thinking about the menu mix and having a variety of things, and of course representing myself as well. And I do that through, you know, the flavor profiles of like fermentation and, and the things that I like to use in my cooking.
Jaymee Sire:
Speaking of which, if somebody out there is listening and kind of wants to start exploring maybe some of these Korean flavors at home, what dishes do you recommend that they start with?
Esther Choi:
I think the, probably the, I guess the, to Korean food is Korean barbecue. I mean, it's, it's so coveted and loved and you know, it, it's just delicious, you know,
Jaymee Sire:
If, if somebody has not had that experience, how would you describe it?
Esther Choi:
Korean barbecue classically is a grill in front of you, and then lots of meat, short ribs, like all the different types of cuts of meat usually marinated in like a soy sesame oil marinade. And then they grill it right in front of you, and then you eat it with like a lettuce wrap, and then all the banchan, which are the little side dishes that are usually seasonal, some pickles and kimchi, things like that. And then you make your lettuce wrap with like, the different sauces. And the beauty of it is that you can kind of mix and match and mm-hmm. eat whatever combinations that you like. So it's very like, personalized to your own kind of want and need. And the greatest thing is, is that it's, it's meat and vegetables really
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah, I think, uh, that's definitely on on most people's, you know, eat mm-hmm. , eat every day list kind of thing. And I know that also, you know, just the idea of kind of sharing dishes, communal dining, that it's a big, you know, an important role that it plays in Korean cuisine. Why is that such an important aspect of the culture?
Esther Choi:
I think because family is such a big theme in every Korean household. I mean, in Korea in general, like, it's just the most important thing, family. I mean, I think in life in general, everyone would agree. So it was just a way to eat, you know, like in a big table all around, sharing everything. And that's really what family's about - sharing.
Jaymee Sire:
It is. Is there anything that you wish people knew more about Korean food?
Esther Choi:
I think that, that there's so many different layers, not mm-hmm. , I know they had a, did talk about Korean barbecue as like kind of the gateway into
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. No, I mean, I love using it for like a wing sauce, although I know that that's also very Korean as well, but I mean, yeah, like switch up, switch up your hot sauces for your, for your wings, right?
Esther Choi:
Yeah, definitely.
Jaymee Sire:
Stick around because Esther reveals her favorite Food Network shows and talks about what it was like to cook against Bobby Flay. When we come back, you know, as we kind of start, you know, talking about also your, you know, your TV career as well, what is it like for you to be representing this cuisine that you obviously are so passionate about on, you know, a national or a global stage, whether it's cooking competitively or judging or, or any of these things?
Esther Choi:
Well, I, it, it's definitely, it's, it's a big responsibility. I think that's number one. So of course I have to really know my stuff that
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. And and you've mentioned, you know, earlier in the conversation that you grew up a fan of Food Network, obviously ended up interning and working there, but what, what shows did you love watching, you know, as a kid?
Esther Choi:
Oh my God, so many. I was obsessed with Food Network growing up. I loved Iron Chef. That was a very big inspiration for me. And, and I got to work on a few seasons of Iron Chef when, when I worked at the network, which was really, really amazing moment. And I think I just love in the kitchen shows mm-hmm. and I still feel like I could watch it all day
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. No, I, I, I think there's something to be said for that, a little bit of a slower pace. You hear the, you know, the pots and pans banging it, it is, it's just kind of like a soothing, you know, thing to have.
Esther Choi:
I love it
Jaymee Sire:
So, yeah, absolutely. But speaking of competition, you've been on Beat Bobby Fly, you've been a guest judge on Chopped, I guess, did anything surprise you about being on a Food Network set as the talent, you know, versus, like you said, kind of working behind the scenes on some of these other shows?
Esther Choi:
Well, I think that the biggest thing is that you don't realize is it's hard to be talent. It's, it's really not easy. It's long hours. It's definitely, you know, work, right? You're, you're putting in the work and it's a lot of pressure because, you know, not only do you have to like cook, there's like cameras all over you and you have to like, speak well, and there's a lot of things that people don't think about. And that I didn't think about. I was like, oh, wow, you know, it, it's really hard to be talent and you have to be good. So, yeah, it's a, it's a learning progress.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
So, Bobby and I are good friends and we cook together, you know, many, many times. And it's super fun to cook with him because he's fun. He's just a fun guy and super intense and really competitive
Jaymee Sire:
Well, more importantly, what did it feel like to beat him alongside your bud Leah Cohen on holiday? Throwdown.
Esther Choi:
I mean, it's always great to win, you know,
Jaymee Sire:
But I mean, I think on that, that the holiday Throwdown special, you guys were the only ones to actually beat him, right. And he was going up against some other talented chefs in their own cuisine as well. So it's, it's not as, as easy as you make it sound
Esther Choi:
Yeah. I mean, he's tough, right? Like, he, he can throw it down. I mean, that's what he does, right? And he's, he, and, and it's like, it's his territory, his kitchen mm-hmm. . So, you know, there are advantages, but I mean, for me it would be like, I represent Korean food. I have to obviously beat him in Korean food. That's like, I, I wouldn't be able to live with myself by today.
Jaymee Sire:
What do you think makes him so good in that arena?
Esther Choi:
I think it's the mental power, you know, and also lots of practice, you know, he's done, he's done like thousands of competitions and it practice makes perfect. And that's in anything in life, it's like a sport, right? Competing, I mean, cooking is definitely very equivalent to like playing sports. You have to practice, and the more you practice, the better you get. It's just what it is.
Jaymee Sire:
So what dish do you think that you would try to, you know, go up against him with that is more in line with like what he's familiar cooking? Have you thought about it?
Esther Choi:
I don't know. With pasta
Jaymee Sire:
Like pasta, anything Southwestern, like anything with chili peppers in it.
Esther Choi:
Like, I don't know, paella.
Jaymee Sire:
Oh yeah, there you go.
Esther Choi:
Yeah. I mean, he cooks like so many different things, but I feel like right now he's like obsessed with Italian food, so yes. So, so I'm thinking maybe that. I'm obsessed with Italian food as well. Yeah.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
I think on the flip side, obviously it's not as hard as competing, but judging is also a difficult thing. Like, you have to think about a lot of things, and these are people's, like careers and livelihoods, and you have to be really fair. And for me, it comes down to thoughtfulness of the dish and how it was composed. And when, when I say that, it means like, you know, textures, flavor profile, different elements, and you can really see a chef through their cooking, you know, like what type chef they are. And I think that for me, like the thoughtfulness that someone gives to a dish really matters. I mean, obviously, you know, skillsets and like, and basic techniques have to all be there. That's like, kind of the basic thing. But I think what makes a dish really special is when, you know, you can kind of read a chef through their food, and also in the end it has to be delicious,
Jaymee Sire:
Actual dish. Mm-hmm. , I mean, I guess also it's, it's hard when, you know, Chopped is throwing, you know, four random ingredients at you as well. Yeah. But yeah, at the end of the day, make it taste good. And that's half the battle, right,
Esther Choi:
Exactly. Like, as long as it tastes really good, I think like every other thing can kind of come into play.
Jaymee Sire:
Which do you prefer competing or, or judging?
Esther Choi:
I mean, like I said, like judging is
Jaymee Sire:
A lot easier.
Esther Choi:
A lot easier. It's like peace of mind. Like you don't stress out and get so nervous where, you know, before any competition, I'm literally, I can't sleep for days. I'm like sweating and I'm like, you know, and I'm thinking about like every combination of everything out there, because you really don't know what you're gonna get and what's gonna happen during battle. And it's like mentally very exhausting because you have to like, prepare. And I'm just so competitive that like, I can't live with myself if I lost, like I, I would be, yeah. I would just beat myself up to death. Like, that's just how I am. So.
Jaymee Sire:
How do you prepare for, for a competition? I mean, like, especially not knowing necessarily what you're gonna be cooking. Like do you practice, do you time yourself? Like, or are you, is it more of like a mental preparation?
Esther Choi:
Jaymee, don't tell anyone
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. No, it makes sense. I mean, you know, we were talking about it being similar to a sporting event and athletes definitely don't walk into games without practicing, you know? So.
Esther Choi:
Exactly
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. Is there a Food Network chef that you would love to cook with or against?
Esther Choi:
Well, so I love Alex , and I've never cooked with her before, so I would love to have a chance to cook with Alex. And actually next month I'm cooking a dinner with Bobby and Michael Simon.
Jaymee Sire:
Nice.
Esther Choi:
Yeah, we're doing a beautiful charity dinner and it's obviously such an honor to cook alongside with them. And I've never done a dinner like that before with Bobby or Michael, so I'm very excited for that. And yeah, so I mean, but cooking with any of the chefs obviously is, it's just such an honor because, you know, like, like I said, you're only as good as you know who you're cooking with and you, it inspires you to be better.
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah. Well, we look forward to seeing you cook on our screens a lot more in the future. We are going to finish things off with a little rapid fire round, and then we have one final question for you. Okay. All right. Rapid fire questions. Your quirky food habit.
Esther Choi:
Love eating with my hands.
Jaymee Sire:
Okay.
Esther Choi:
Anything like slurp-able, I would say, you know, like noodles obviously, but like pasta, like anything that I can, like slurp, I like just love noodles.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
Koreatown for sure.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
It's like open 24/7 and it's like lit at like 4:00 AM so it's the best.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
I would have to say. Anywhere in Asia, it's just like a fun, like such a different experience when you're out there and it's very, very food motivated, obviously. So for me. Yeah. Always.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
Matcha ice cream.
Jaymee Sire:
Okay. Your favorite New York borough?
Esther Choi:
Manhattan, of course.
Jaymee Sire:
All right. Cooking disaster you'll never forget?
Esther Choi:
I was doing a big dinner for like a hundred people and my ice cream did not set in the freezer. There's something like wrong with it, so I have to turn. I know. It was insane. And it was really last minute and I realized that it didn't set, so I had to turn the ice cream into like a parfait and call it something different.
Jaymee Sire:
Esther Choi:
God, this is so hard. This is like crazy because like you're throwing the whole like anything. Yeah. Like it's the
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah, no, it sounds perfect.
Esther Choi:
Yeah. And then for lunch, I would probably take my grandmother to Korea and we would eat at Choeng Wun’s Temple, which is like Buddhist temple cuisine. And you know, it's all like vegan food and it's all like such beautifully thoughtful temple cuisine. Hmm. And it would be my dream to have a meal like that with my grandmother and have Choeng Wun kind of like cooking for us. It would be super special to do that. And for dinner, I, I have to say, I mean this is kind of pretentious and probably like so typical, but I have to go to Noma because
Jaymee Sire:
And they're closing soon, right?
Ester Choi:
I know.
Jaymee Sire:
Not soon, but like, yeah.
Esther Choi:
Yeah. Exactly. So I mean, I have to, I mean, it's like I have to experience it at least once, so I might do that this summer. Who knows? I don't know.
Jaymee Sire:
Yeah, you're going, yeah, you can.You can do whatever you want. Exactly.
Esther Choi:
And then I think for dessert, I'm not like a big sweets person. Like I don't really eat dessert. So I think that it would have to just be like in the streets of Rome, kind of like walking around, eating like pasta, having the glass of wine in that weird like little like door where they'd like hand you wine if you walk on it.
Jaymee Sire:
I mean, that sounds like a pretty sweet ending to your perfect food day, your global, you know. I know. World Trotting Food Day. No, it sounds perfect. Mm-hmm. , thank you again for taking the time and it, and again, congratulations on your hotlist, I guess nod. And we look forward to seeing more of you soon.
Esther Choi:
Thank you so much, Jaymee. I had such a fun conversation with you. Thanks for having me on the podcast.
Jaymee Sire:
You can follow along with Esther on Instagram. Her handle is choibites. And make sure to follow us wherever you listen to podcasts so you don't miss a thing. And if you enjoy today's episode, please rate and review. We love it when you do that. That's all for now. We'll catch you foodies next Friday.